Comments on: An observation about database systems (relational and otherwise) http://wagnerblog.com/2006/07/an-observation-about-database-systems-relational-and-otherwise/ Development Ideas and Ramblings Tue, 14 Oct 2008 20:14:10 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Stuart Stirling http://wagnerblog.com/2006/07/an-observation-about-database-systems-relational-and-otherwise/comment-page-1/#comment-397 Stuart Stirling Wed, 19 Dec 2007 04:33:17 +0000 http://wagnerblog.com/?p=642#comment-397 Hi, just wondering if I could get permission to use this image on my website? http://www.wagnerblog.com/images/Lemmings_20_28Fortean_20Times_29_small.jpg Thanks and waiting for your reply. Stuart Hi, just wondering if I could get permission to use this image on my website? http://www.wagnerblog.com/images/Lemmings_20_28Fortean_20Times_29_small.jpg
Thanks and waiting for your reply.
Stuart

]]> By: Thomas Wagner http://wagnerblog.com/2006/07/an-observation-about-database-systems-relational-and-otherwise/comment-page-1/#comment-392 Thomas Wagner Fri, 07 Jul 2006 14:35:55 +0000 http://wagnerblog.com/?p=642#comment-392 Christof - of course I don't have an exact number of the RDBMS penetration in the world. Hence 99% is used as a methaphore to indicate "a msjority". Its my oversight not to have noticed that you specialize in embedded systems. Of course your numbers make a lot of sense there. And that also means you have a darn interesting product for that space. It might be fun to create a project that mimicks what you describe - embedded on one end and server based on the other. Thanks for the feedback! Christof – of course I don’t have an exact number of the RDBMS penetration in the world. Hence 99% is used as a methaphore to indicate “a msjority”. Its my oversight not to have noticed that you specialize in embedded systems. Of course your numbers make a lot of sense there. And that also means you have a darn interesting product for that space. It might be fun to create a project that mimicks what you describe – embedded on one end and server based on the other. Thanks for the feedback!

]]> By: Christof http://wagnerblog.com/2006/07/an-observation-about-database-systems-relational-and-otherwise/comment-page-1/#comment-393 Christof Thu, 06 Jul 2006 17:33:56 +0000 http://wagnerblog.com/?p=642#comment-393 "99% of all data storage in this world is based on RDBMS systems." I disagree. Our market research in the embedded database space (storage being fully integrated with one's product or application) showed that 50% of the developers write their own database because RDBMS are not well suited for zero-admin usage. Examples are Boeing's MMA aircraft, BMW's future car control system, Seagate's line of personal server products, the world market leader's photocopier system and many more. Many developers are not familiar with this space - and many companies in this space do not talk about it a lot, because using a product like db4o is part of their competitive advantage. Furthermore, now, with the availability of small footprint, super lean and easy to learn db4o as an embeddable OO persistence, people use storages where they just didn't use them before (or compromised on flexibility etc. by using flat file or serialization). Examples are pharmaceutical companies, that cache their scientific object models on clients, because it is too slow to retrieve data from a central server. Or mobile enterprise solutions of partially connected devices (doorstep delivery systems). And so on. With this powerful tool, forward-thinking developers can build more feature-rich products, more performant products, and refactor more easily. I agree, RDBMS are very strong in server-centric environments, but they do a poor job in distributed, client-centric persistence scenarios. Together with db4o's object-to-relational replication system (dRS), based on Hibernate, we bring the best of these worlds together. Having said all this, obviously, I totally agree with your analysis about the trends of data access. Christof, db4objects, Inc. “99% of all data storage in this world is based on RDBMS systems.”

I disagree. Our market research in the embedded database space (storage being fully integrated with one’s product or application) showed that 50% of the developers write their own database because RDBMS are not well suited for zero-admin usage.

Examples are Boeing’s MMA aircraft, BMW’s future car control system, Seagate’s line of personal server products, the world market leader’s photocopier system and many more.

Many developers are not familiar with this space – and many companies in this space do not talk about it a lot, because using a product like db4o is part of their competitive advantage.

Furthermore, now, with the availability of small footprint, super lean and easy to learn db4o as an embeddable OO persistence, people use storages where they just didn’t use them before (or compromised on flexibility etc. by using flat file or serialization).

Examples are pharmaceutical companies, that cache their scientific object models on clients, because it is too slow to retrieve data from a central server. Or mobile enterprise solutions of partially connected devices (doorstep delivery systems). And so on.

With this powerful tool, forward-thinking developers can build more feature-rich products, more performant products, and refactor more easily.

I agree, RDBMS are very strong in server-centric environments, but they do a poor job in distributed, client-centric persistence scenarios. Together with db4o’s object-to-relational replication system (dRS), based on Hibernate, we bring the best of these worlds together.

Having said all this, obviously, I totally agree with your analysis about the trends of data access.

Christof, db4objects, Inc.

]]> By: Jason Haley http://wagnerblog.com/2006/07/an-observation-about-database-systems-relational-and-otherwise/comment-page-1/#comment-394 Jason Haley Wed, 05 Jul 2006 13:45:13 +0000 http://wagnerblog.com/?p=642#comment-394 <strong>Interesting Finds: July 5, 2006</strong> Interesting Finds: July 5, 2006

]]> By: Haacked http://wagnerblog.com/2006/07/an-observation-about-database-systems-relational-and-otherwise/comment-page-1/#comment-395 Haacked Tue, 04 Jul 2006 21:50:05 +0000 http://wagnerblog.com/?p=642#comment-395 Not to mention that the data organizational principles change even less, if at all. Regardless of the data storage technology, the abstract concept of how to organize data (normalized relational form) is founded on firm mathematical ground. So it's not like we'll see dramatic improvements to the 3rd or 5th normal form (6th normal form anyone?). However, that's not to say some new mathematical structure can't be found, but if it were, it would be a paradigm shift and represent something truly new. Not to mention that the data organizational principles change even less, if at all. Regardless of the data storage technology, the abstract concept of how to organize data (normalized relational form) is founded on firm mathematical ground. So it’s not like we’ll see dramatic improvements to the 3rd or 5th normal form (6th normal form anyone?).

However, that’s not to say some new mathematical structure can’t be found, but if it were, it would be a paradigm shift and represent something truly new.

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